wolfishxwillow | Ranting over types of fic...

...because it's just been bugging me and bugging me and I figure maybe typing it out will make me feel better or something. Feel free to ignore this post.

Okay, I haven't read too many evil!Sam/Dean fics, because evil!Sam squicks me a bit (unless it's evil!Sam/evil!Dean, where they are equal, that doesn't bother me as much). Like, I think he's awesome on the show (BUaBS, for example) but when I read about him, I just feel horrible and can't get myself to like it.

But the ones I have read seem to have Dean as really willful and hard to break, right? It takes a ton of horrible acts against him, by Sam or Sam's new demon followers or whatever. But he rarely just gives in right away.

Here's where I get annoyed. I love demon!Dean fics. (Have I mentioned I'm an evil person?) Especially demon!Dean/Sam fics. The problem I have is that when I look for/find fics with this pairing, it always seems to be immediately con, or dubcon... Which, okay. Sam resists for a couple paragraphs... I can totally understand the Sam-mindset of not being able to survive without Dean in his life anymore (since these fics tend to be set after Dean goes to Hell) and he is willing to do whatever it takes to stay with Dean. Or Sam completely hates what his brother has become, but still loves Dean and takes whatever Dean does to him because it's his brother...

What gives? Okay, I can't remember the title or author or anything of this one evil!Sam/Dean fic. But it had Sam breaking Dean; I believe he slept in a cage, gagged and blindfolded. And when he was out, he was pulled along with a collar and leash. And as it goes on, Dean starts breaking, starts actually wanting to make Sam happy or something... I haven't read it since that first time I found it months and months ago, because I realized just how much I can't handle it when Sam is in the bad guy role...

But why aren't there any fics like that, only reversed? Sam is stubborn! Yes, he loves his big brother. But he isn't going to be cool with Dean going around killing people or just being evil in general. I want a fic with demon!Dean breaking stubborn!defiant!Sam until Sam starts to crack, wanting to be a good pet or whatever...

Ugh, I know... I feel like crap just writing that. But I get really annoyed at how uneven those fics are. Because I can only ever find dubcon at most between demon!Dean and Sam, whereas Dean always seems to be portrayed as so much stronger in demon!evil!Sam/Dean... and it's been grating on my nerves for weeks...

Okay, I'd actually originally wanted to come on and rave about how awesome my 21st birthday was this week, but that didn't happen this time around. Maybe I'll post the happenings of that tomorrow or sometime...

Now I should really go spend some time on my SPN slash Big Bang fic, I think. I've got nearly half the minimum word count done, and I've still got so much more story to tell... O.O It's taken over my brain...

Threaded | Top-Level Comments Only

First Happy (belated) Birthday!!!!
I hope you had a wonderful time!

I read your rant and I wanted to leave a reply because I have some idea why the fics are so uneven.

I'm writing evil!Sam and Dean myself (that's for next year though, I have 3 other fics in the works for 2010) and my fics are uneven too.

I have an evil!Sam with a stubborn Dean and an evil!Dean with a Sam who breaks in the first paragraph. Hey! Heyyyy! Please don't run away sweetie... I have an explanation ;)

Okay. I think the reason a lot of people write Dean as more resistant to Sam's evil is because it's in character. In SPN, Dean is always very opposed to Sam being bad or going darkside.

Sam on the other hand _and please don't throw rotten eggs my way, lol. I love Sam with all my heart and yes he's sweet and adorable and GOOD_ is more, how shall I put it..."comfortable" with the darkness in others. Time and time again, he's been drawn to "things" that were pure or semi-evil dressed up as human (best friend, prom date, Mady, Ruby). Sam was even able to sleep with a corpse possessed by a demon.

Knowing that Sam found it in himself to accept something like Ruby (for whatever reasons), it's hard to write him as this person who would all of the sudden find darkness unacceptable (for more than a few paragraphs) just because it's in Dean, the brother he loves so much, who has always been good, and who only turned evil because something horrible happened to him (Hell).It would almost seem unfair.

I know it doesn't change the fact that you don't like this biais (resistant!Dean, easy to break Sam) but I hope it gives you some insight into the minds of some(I'm not speacking for all of them of course) evil!Dean, evil!Sam writers.

I hope you find the demon!Dean, stubborn!defiant!Sam fic you're looking for. They have almost everything on Spn story finders :)

BTW I'm so excited about the Big Bang, if only for the fact that someone will make me a banner for my fic, hihi.

*sigh* Yeah, I get what people are thinking with that. I really do. Because I can see that in the show. And, honestly, before I got into fanfiction (and before I noticed the different Sam bashing going on through Seasons 4 and 5...) I really liked the whole evil!Sam thing. Seriously, my bestie was soo annoyed with all my happy squees during "I Know What You Did Last Summer" and other episodes like it. I just found that when I started reading fic, it was hard for me to read evil!Sam without ending up in a funk for hours/days and feeling really horrible. It took me awhile to realize that meant it was one of my squicks.

It just makes me sad that I can't get my hurt!broken!Sam fix the way Dean girls can get it in fic. >.< And I've actually requested fics like this from spnstoryfinders before, but couldn't find much. It's almost like looking for a good Sam mpreg. lol

Dude, right? Days, days after I signed up for the Big Bang I was out with one of my friends and it just popped into my head randomly, "Wait, it's Big Bang! That means I get artwork! *squee*" and got some funny looks. But I haven't ever had art for my fics before, so it's sooo awesome. Now I've just got to make sure I get the story done before the deadline. 'Cause I think it's going to get longer than I'd originally thought. (Probably a good thing, if it makes the minimum word count easier to reach, though, huh?)

I get your rant, I really do. And I ALSO agree with ladycrystal's explanation- I think something must have 'forced' Dean to go evil, so that there's a possibility for Sam to 'fix it'- only then could you get your fic, I think. Because if there's a TINY possible for Dean to get good again, then I think Sam would fight much harder against turning evil himself.

(Also- most of the reason Dean keeps saying 'no' is because Sam would say 'yes' otherwise. Dean is Sam's link to the Good. :P )

Hm. Maybe I'll try to write an Evil!Dean/Sam fic. Hm.

Yeah... that's what sucks about the timeline with canon and everything. It would be great to have an evil!Dean/Sam fic around seasons 1 or 2, because that's before Sam started moving towards the darkness. Especially season 1. Because he's stubborn and defiant, and ultimately good. Yeah, he's dealing with that anger and need for revenge, but John was too and he didn't turn evil. And we all know how much Sam and John are alike (doesn't mean I have to like it...). Because while Sam was easily manipulated after Dean went to Hell, he wouldn't have been so before that happened. I don't think that he's really all that easy to manipulate, honestly. I mean, it took his girlfriend being murdered, his father selling his soul, fighting other psychic children, dying, coming back, Dean selling his soul, Dean going to hell, and then Ruby playing off of that for him to be turned toward the "dark side". So it would be awesome to see something happen earlier in the series. Maybe, like, for the four years Sam was gone Dean went off the deep end or something and he came back to get Sam, but acted completely normal at first. And hey, they haven't seen much of each other in four years, who's to say Dean just hasn't picked up a few new habits, right? And then evil!Dean comes out to play and break Sam. I think that would cause it to take longer to break the younger Winchester. *nodnod*

Hell, I'll take shifter!Dean breaking Sam. 'Cause I've only ever found 1 where shifter!Dean took real!Dean and locked him away somewhere in order to force Sam to come with him instead. And acts just like the real Dean, except with that extra volatile temper and the want for a good little submissive!Sam in bed. ;)

...Holy crap, I really am an evil person...

Also, thanks for the "happy birthday" bit. When I saw that, I got a huge smile on my face. I just got distracted from thanking you by the evil!Dean/Sam discussion. lol
<3<3<3

XD Yeah, yeah, we're all going to Hell and we know it. XD

Mmm, I like your scenarios. Except for the fact that my muse half-likes them, and so now I have all these half- ideas in my head I don't know what to do with, OR time to write. :S

No, I don't really think Sam's easy to manipulate. He can be kinda gullible, especially in the earlier seasons, but he's not STUPID. If there's something amiss, he'll figure it out and then be the good guy. All the lines get blurry after season three, and that's also because the 'good' line isn't as clear anymore either. I mean, his brother was 'good' and still went to Hell, just like his Dad did.

I've read one good shifter!Dean fic, where shifter!Dean was picking up on Dean's want for Dean. He used that fact to break Sam, who wanted his brother too. ("Dean wants it too, you know... Just never had the guts to take it. The way I'm taking it now. You like that, Sammy? To think that your brother jerks off to you in the Impala, thanks about fucking you raw?" )

Yeah, I've read as many shifter!Dean/Sam fics as I could get my hands on. And I love most of them. I just love a broken!submissive!Sammy and those are a little bit harder to come by. lol

*smishes Sam* Poor boy, I abuse him sooo much. Whether it's in my fic or the fics I read. lol

I know, I kinda want to write another evil!Dean story ('cause the only one I've ever written had a submissive!Sam who would do whatever Dean told him to because of his twisted love for his brother... And damn, I kinda wrote the fics I was ranting about, didn't I?) where Sam resists him. But it's so hard to write that. Like, I know how I would want it to happen, but I couldn't get it written out. >.< That's happened with quite a few fics I've started writing and the abandoned to collect dust on my laptop. lol

Mmmh, I love those. (Uhrm, feel free to link me... *cough cough*)

Yeah, poor bicycle:/

(... You kinda did. That's okay, tho- we're all hypocrites one way or another. :D ) Myeah, it's hard. I've actually written a fic now(my muse came through with SOMETHING, I guess) featuring evil!Dean/Sam, and... IDK. I've TRIED to keep Sam sane, but GOD my mind can be nasty when it wants to. I'm trying to learn how to write porn, which... still doesn't work. IDK, I've sent it to someone to see through, tell me if it's complete rubbish or not. If not, you'll find it on my journal soon. Maybe. :P

If you're interested, here's my fic: http://princess-aleera.livejournal.com/39814.html?view=149382#t149382

IDEK. It's not nice. Like, really. Also, I've been trying to write porn, and ugggggh. It's hard.

Read it if you want to. *shrugs and smiles*

Ranting over types of fic...

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